[youngsmith53]

I replaced that mount, i had the car up on just ramps. est time 3 hours and that was taking my time. No problems since i installed it. Make sure there is no binding when you install it. You will defiantly feel it in the shifts. I did have to wiggle the transmission and engine a bit. Make sure you buy a quality star socket kit and that the socket is big enough for the star bolts.

Not sure how much I will actually feel as you have the manual and I the automatic. I'll be reporting back no matter what, thanks for the heads up with everything. If all goes well I will be installing the mount/removing the front fascia the evening of 10/09 and proceeding with the installation of the aux cooler and the other goodies that Saturday 10/11 then...

Edit: Can't wait to see your data logging as well

 

[youngsmith53]

Give z max trans additive a shot same with the oil and fuel as well I did all 3 and feel a nice difference in the car especially the transmission when it's in auto stick soooooo much smoother. Also getting the imperial high performance transmission cooler soon so we can compare the difference. Waiting on the transmission temp gauge, volt gauge, and intake temp gauge as well.

@R3DMONSTER just because I was curious, I was checking out the different transmission additives and what not. You mentioned you added the Z-Max Transmission additive... since on the website the screen shot is the following:

So, I guess my question is, what fill hole did you use to add the fluid? Since the power-tech is a "Sealed Transmission", I am curious to see where you exactly put the fluid in. The only place I was able to find remotely to a fill spot was this:

Diagram view:

13 - Oil Level Plug
14 - Oil Level

I will see what I can find out, but I would like to know your findings since you have already added something to the power-tech transmission fluid.

To be perfectly honest, I'm just going to do a regular fluid replacement and save my money. Its like engine oil. Good oil is all you need. This ATF fluid doesn't really need additives, it's just that good and I don't like to mess with a good fluid. (why I have been using Mobil 1 for as long as I an remember)

If I can get my hands on some FLUIDAFT-AUTOMATICTRANSMISSION (By the Quart 68171866AA or Gallon 68171869AA) and in give or take 35,400 miles we'll be looking at this thread and doing my first transmission fluid change.

Sorry @R3DMONSTER the curiosity was killing this cat when I was re-reading the thread.

 

[abnoxiousorange]

I am replacing the rear engine mount, not the side transmission mount. Just the rear engine mount as seen here from the http://www.dodge-dart.org/forum/dey...racing/2476-new-product-pf1rmm-solid-polyurethane-filled-rear-engine-mount.html thread:

View attachment 42159
photo courtesy of @DeyemeRacing

I might in the spring, spring (see what I did there) for the side transmission and side engine mounts as well, but to get the most out of it for the time being I went with just the rear engine mount.

EDIT: Just curious @Bullfrog at the 220F engine coolant temp reading, did/was your radiator fan kicked on?

@youngsmith53 Does the 2.0 have EGR? I was hitting 224* on my engine after a WOT pull before I completely got rid of my EGR (and my engine does not have all those covers and aero equipment). The EGR runs hot coolant through the cylinder head thus raising temps. You would need a tune to delete it safely without a CEL though. Also a good mod for cooler temps and more performance, also be on the lookout for a 180* t-stat. Not sure if one is available though..

 

[youngsmith53]

@youngsmith53 Does the 2.0 have EGR? I was hitting 224* on my engine after a WOT pull before I completely got rid of my EGR (and my engine does not have all those covers and aero equipment). The EGR runs hot coolant through the cylinder head thus raising temps. You would need a tune to delete it safely without a CEL though. Also a good mod for cooler temps and more performance, also be on the lookout for a 180* t-stat. Not sure if one is available though..

The only thing I could find the following in regards to EGR Systems:
2013 DODGE Dart SXT 2.0L I4 DOHC, 6-Speed Automatic

The link should work, but from the looks of it, I don't see EGR after Googling and checking the schematics of the engine...

As far as the 180* t-stat, I am coming up with no-dice currently, and I can't really find "universal ones" so to speak. But hell, for the price it looks like it's another one of those sub $100 that makes a difference.

I was however able to find the stock thermostat information, part number: 05047263AC

 

[abnoxiousorange]

The only thing I could find the following in regards to EGR Systems:
2013 DODGE Dart SXT 2.0L I4 DOHC, 6-Speed Automatic

The link should work, but from the looks of it, I don't see EGR after Googling and checking the schematics of the engine...

As far as the 180* t-stat, I am coming up with no-dice currently, and I can't really find "universal ones" so to speak. But hell, for the price it looks like it's another one of those sub $100 that makes a difference.

I was however able to find the stock thermostat information, part number: 05047263AC
View attachment 42168

An EGR shows up in Advance Auto so there appears to be one, one more thing to be looking forward to deleting once you have a tune. @youngsmith53 is the T-stat housing similar to the 2.0/2.4 Calibers? You might be in luck, just do research first to make sure fitment is the same. Sometimes you have to look to the past.

r/t 180 degree thermostat - Page 2 - Dodge Caliber SRT-4 Forums

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/snn-14678?seid=srese1&gclid=CKzp3t3FicECFUMF7AodYxAAGA

 

[youngsmith53]

@abnoxiousorange , checked the Caliber and the Neon and no dice as well... with the 180* t-stat, I might need to just remove it take it to the local auto store and see what I can come up with...

Caliber:

Neon:
Can't find the schematic, but its more than likely not the same, lol...

As far as the EGR, I am finding very little about it I got it from here: pothiermotors.com

as well as here: greencarcongress
2.4-liter Tigershark Engine with MultiAir 2.
The aluminum cylinder head includes a four valves-per-cylinder arrangement with 36 mm intake valves for optimum performance without sacrificing fuel efficiency. MultiAir 2 allows better control of the start and end of the valve events and an extended opening on the intake cycle for better exhaust gas recirculation. Both features improve fuel economy.

Other than that I am finding very little on the 2.0L having that, I have checked Advance an other's on the webs and I can find 70's Darts with EGR, but nothing with current 2.0L versions...

 

[abnoxiousorange]

@abnoxiousorange , checked the Caliber and the Neon and no dice as well... with the 180* t-stat, I might need to just remove it take it to the local auto store and see what I can come up with...

Caliber:
View attachment 42171

Neon:
Can't find the schematic, but its more than likely not the same, lol...

As far as the EGR, I am finding very little about it I got it from here: pothiermotors.com

View attachment 42170

as well as here: greencarcongress
2.4-liter Tigershark Engine with MultiAir 2.
The aluminum cylinder head includes a four valves-per-cylinder arrangement with 36 mm intake valves for optimum performance without sacrificing fuel efficiency. MultiAir 2 allows better control of the start and end of the valve events and an extended opening on the intake cycle for better exhaust gas recirculation. Both features improve fuel economy.

Other than that I am finding very little on the 2.0L having that, I have checked Advance an other's on the webs and I can find 70's Darts with EGR, but nothing with current 2.0L versions...

Yep, get the Caliber one and compare it with a Dart unit. If not see if a parts store can match you up with a 180* unit that fits in the housing. I am willing to bet that the Caliber unit will work even if the housings are slightly different in design. Good luck! Don't even bother looking for Neon parts, it's 2.0 is not based off the world engine design.

 

[youngsmith53]

Yep, get the Caliber one and compare it with a Dart unit. If not see if a parts store can match you up with a 180* unit that fits in the housing. I am willing to bet that the Caliber unit will work even if the housings are slightly different in design. Good luck! Don't even bother looking for Neon parts, it's 2.0 is not based off the world engine design.

Already found one on eBay...

 

[abnoxiousorange]

Already found one on eBay...

You found a possible match? Everything looks like it will fit?

 

[youngsmith53]

You found a possible match? Everything looks like it will fit?

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=271546791220

That's from a caliber. Not sure if it will fit or not.

 

[abnoxiousorange]

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=271546791220

That's from a caliber. Not sure if it will fit or not.

Looks like no parts are showing up no matter where I try. Perhaps try the dealership and see what they turn up with so you can compare and contrast. I am willing to bet that the Caliber unit could possibly work. Don't pull the trigger quite yet. Lets do some comparing/contrasting first.

 

[starscream5000]

Going with a colder t-stat may drop your MPGs (if you worry about that sort of thing) without a way to tune for it. The LX platform was that way anyways...

 

[Bullfrog]

Well anything is better then running a boiling hot cooling system... i will say this i dont think the dart will have ANY problems providing enough heat in the winter.

So how much of the MPG VS HP do you thing the engineers put into the engines? do they lean for the MPG more? there has to be a delta on a chart someplace that shows the break even point. Or has it got to the point that they are trying to do everything possible to be 'Green' leaving us to do the tweaking?


You guys are going to love the graphs im putting together.... duel Y axis color charts, one showing RPM and Temps and another just showing air temp's from sensors vs coolant temps. i finely settled on a format and size and such last night. after i get home today from work CAI install after the engine cools down a bit for me! and more logging.

 

[youngsmith53]

Looks like no parts are showing up no matter where I try. Perhaps try the dealership and see what they turn up with so you can compare and contrast. I am willing to bet that the Caliber unit could possibly work. Don't pull the trigger quite yet. Lets do some comparing/contrasting first.

@abnoxiousorange , Unfortunately, I haven't been able to lock down a "real" pic of our t-stat. With that being said, I'm all for doing more R&D and making sure things are done right the first time and not have to re-trace my steps from a screw up. (see my deleted posts on my mis-information on 2.4L coppers, lol) But anyway, I think I am at my max of things I want to re-introduce/introduce to the engine next week anyway. Too much and I don't know what really was beneficial, too little and I want to do more... Need to save some mods/money for the spring anyway to look forward to

Spring might finally bring Aya some suspension mods, BUT if a header get released, then suspension will wait until spring of 2016... priorities. lol
@starscream5000 I didn't forget about you Yeah, I know what you mean with the MPG factor and the 180 t-stat losing some MPG's here or there. I also thought that as well when I did the min AGS Fins on the 2.0, I remember reading when you did (or still have) your AGS fins at a minimum you lost some MPG's. Me, it seemed like it helped out the engine in my case (for some reason unknown)...

When I had the AGS fins like this:
(Looking at the front of the car)
XXXX -----
XXXX XXXX
XXXX XXXX
------ XXXX
I got the best MPG's out of my tank by far...

When I changed and went to this:
(Looking at the front of the car)
----- -----
xxxx -----
xxxx -----
----- -----
I am still able to get good MPG's, but not like I was when I had the min set up. I was however able to get more miles out of the tank with this set up, but with a lower (still 33+ MPG's) average MPG's.

I'm not an engineer, and I certainly and no shade-tree mechanic, I'm just a curious Joe (well Josh, lol) that likes to work on his car, I only really stated working cars for a few years so I gots a lot to learn to get on the level of you guys on the forums. I'm just trying to make a dent and help out as much as I can...

*takes a breath and sip of water*

Sounds great to me @Bullfrog ... can't wait to see what the graphs show in correlation to each other. I really wanted to make my transmission chart all fancy and whatno, but I don't have the time or patience to open up my excel book and learn. BUT, I will be updating my Transmission Temp spreadsheet this weekend and again on Thursday (10/09) night, so get the final baseline of what I'm up against with the new aux transmission cooler install next week...

With that being said, how are you gathering all of this information? Do you have an Ultragauge to gather all of this or how did you start to compile the data? I have the Ultragauge on my Christmas list for the wife, whether or not she gets it for me is a different story. I'll be picking one up with Christmas money no matter what.

Looking forward to hearing about the CAI installation and more information/data logging just means more we can give to tuners once they turn towards the Dart platform.

 

[Bullfrog]

Spring might finally bring Aya some suspension mods, BUT if a header get released, then suspension will wait until spring of 2016... priorities. lol

I never was one for suspention mods, i assume you mean lowering? My next routes are going for a vendor to do steel braided brake and maybe clutch lines. its been on my radar.


As for the AGF's some air is better then no air but as im seeing in my charts the intake air temp goes down when the rad fan is not on, so the heat soak thats happening is more confined, when the AGF and the fan kick on it bumps the intake temp a bit. I may experiment with building a box around the SRI configuration with a dedicated duct to the front bumper. have to see how much room i have.

Sounds great to me @Bullfrog ... can't wait to see what the graphs show in correlation to each other. I really wanted to make my transmission chart all fancy and whatno, but I don't have the time or patience to open up my excel book and learn. BUT, I will be updating my Transmission Temp spreadsheet this weekend and again on Thursday (10/09) night, so get the final baseline of what I'm up against with the new aux transmission cooler install next week...



With that being said, how are you gathering all of this information? Do you have an Ultragauge to gather all of this or how did you start to compile the data? I have the Ultragauge on my Christmas list for the wife, whether or not she gets it for me is a different story. I'll be picking one up with Christmas money no matter what.

Looking forward to hearing about the CAI installation and more information/data logging just means more we can give to tuners once they turn towards the Dart platform.

data is being logged by my bluetooth obd2 scanner and android app Tourqe. It logs once a second (more if i want to push it but once a second is something like 1500~1800 data points. it takes my laptop about 20 seconds to churn the data into a graph. Tourqe spits out a .csv file and i use excel to make it into a graph. I am more then pleased with the app and the amount of info it gathers. if i had a tablet or a spare smart phone i would dedicate it to logging.

When i post charts ill also post the flat files so people can look at the raw data since to make a chart that shows every second it would be a massively huge file...if i were to print the charts i have now i would need a 2 foot wide piece of paper give you the scale and resolution of the pics.


I may only run a SRI and not pull the wheel and fender out first, i have to get gas when i get home anyhow so i may do a mpg with only a SRI VS CAI but that seems to be about mute as most people see a drop in MPG, i believe you already did this test. Im not a fan of how small the INJEN air filter is. but i may just put it all on and go with it or wait till i get the RRM pully and do the lower end at the same time.

with the availability of obd2 scanner apps and low cost OBD2 scanners i dont know why more Tuners/MFG's/Vendors arnt logging to provide hard data.

Scanner:
Amazon.com: iSaddle Super Mini ELM327 V1.5 OBD2 OBD-II Bluetooth CAN-BUS Auto Diagnostic Tool for Windows & Android Torque (Blue Color): Automotive

App:
Torque OBD2 Wiki

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.prowl.torque&hl=en

 

[youngsmith53]

I never was one for suspention mods, i assume you mean lowering? My next routes are going for a vendor to do steel braided brake and maybe clutch lines. its been on my radar.

As far as suspension mods, I'm not looking to slam Aya or have her glued to the ground where I have navigate the PA roads like they are minefields. I really, just want to tighten up and fine tune what is already there. The main suspension improvements I am looking to do are:

• Eibach Rear Sway Bar
• Deyeme Wheel Spacers and Lug Bolts (10mm/Sleek Black/Black/19mm hex)
• H&R Sport Springs

Eibach Rear Sway Bar - Yes, I could have went with RoadRace's as they are they are both 19mm an upgrade from the stock on Aya right now. It just comes down to pricing with the budget. For our front wheel drive Darts, no need for the front sway bar, just the rears to tune it the understeer out.

Deyeme 10mm Wheel Spacers - The spacers widen the track of the Dart for better handling and high-speed stability, also they help clear the calipers on the fronts. I am thinking about getting performance lightweight 16's in the future and with going down to 16's the width will go down to 7" (7.5" stock) so I want to get back to being as wide as possible.

The H&R springs are IMO severely underrated here on this forum as everyone just wants more LOW. Me personally I don't want more low, I want what springs are meant for, lowering the vehicle center of gravity and reduce body roll for better handling. A lower wind resistance for more streamlined and improve gas mileage. H&R's have superb quality and are stiffer than Eibach's. Only should low about 1.25" front / 1.25" back nothing earth-shattering, just something to true up ride.

As for the AGF's some air is better then no air but as im seeing in my charts the intake air temp goes down when the rad fan is not on, so the heat soak thats happening is more confined, when the AGF and the fan kick on it bumps the intake temp a bit. I may experiment with building a box around the SRI configuration with a dedicated duct to the front bumper. have to see how much room i have.

data is being logged by my bluetooth obd2 scanner and android app Tourqe. It logs once a second (more if i want to push it but once a second is something like 1500~1800 data points. it takes my laptop about 20 seconds to churn the data into a graph. Tourqe spits out a .csv file and i use excel to make it into a graph. I am more then pleased with the app and the amount of info it gathers. if i had a tablet or a spare smart phone i would dedicate it to logging.

When i post charts ill also post the flat files so people can look at the raw data since to make a chart that shows every second it would be a massively huge file...if i were to print the charts i have now i would need a 2 foot wide piece of paper give you the scale and resolution of the pics.

Can't wait to see...

I may only run a SRI and not pull the wheel and fender out first, i have to get gas when i get home anyhow so i may do a mpg with only a SRI VS CAI but that seems to be about mute as most people see a drop in MPG, i believe you already did this test. Im not a fan of how small the INJEN air filter is. but i may just put it all on and go with it or wait till i get the RRM pully and do the lower end at the same time.

Don't bother running the SRI with the Injen, go full CAI right out of the gate. THERE IS NO DROP IN MPG'S. I actually have found the opposite. Just run CAI and the only reason you will be losing MPG's is the first couple of tanks you will be addicted to the sound of the CAI air flow. Other than that there is no change in the MPG's with CAI vs. SRI. Darts don't run better with warm air set-ups. As some one once told me, "you paid for the extra metal tubing might as well use it." Go with CAI and never look back

with the availability of obd2 scanner apps and low cost OBD2 scanners i dont know why more Tuners/MFG's/Vendors arnt logging to provide hard data.

Scanner:
Amazon.com: iSaddle Super Mini ELM327 V1.5 OBD2 OBD-II Bluetooth CAN-BUS Auto Diagnostic Tool for Windows & Android Torque (Blue Color): Automotive

App:
Torque OBD2 Wiki

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.prowl.torque&hl=en

Hmm... I think I have an Android phone laying around the house somewhere... must find and install to test out and save money. Thanks again for the information you have provided and I can't wait to see what you come up with.

Take Care.

 

[jsblanch]

Well anything is better then running a boiling hot cooling system... i will say this i dont think the dart will have ANY problems providing enough heat in the winter.

You'd be surprised, at least with the turbos. When it's really cold out, the 1.4T actually has a hard time making heat, especially if you're not moving very fast. A bunch of us were whining about it last year. The heater core is apparently too effective at draining every calorie/BTU/whatever out of the coolant! However, as I recall, the 2.0L and 2.4L are calibrated to run with higher coolant temps than the 1.4T.

 

[Bullfrog]

However, as I recall, the 2.0L and 2.4L are calibrated to run with higher coolant temps than the 1.4T.

whats the chances of the thermostat fo a 1.4 fitting in a 2.0?
@starscream5000 was it you that was saying they run so bloody hot for emissions?

and then i go and read this....lots of good points..
http://hotrodscott.blogspot.com/2007/08/cooler-thermostats.html

 

[starscream5000]

whats the chances of the thermostat fo a 1.4 fitting in a 2.0?
@starscream5000 was it you that was saying they run so bloody hot for emissions?

Wasn't me that said that, but the 1.4's T-stat is 172-174 degrees. The coldest OEM t-stat I've ever seen.

 

[abnoxiousorange]

@youngsmith53 so much to reply to so I will just keep it general. I know how you feel I think I am done with mods until next spring then it's stage 2 cams, crower springs and retainer, and SVT damper time. Not a bad idea to hold off on that, you will lose some coolant in the process and Mopar HOAT coolant is 80 bux (though I believe Zerex G05 is the same stuff which can be had for cheaper). As hot as these cars run I don't believe he will have a problem running a 180*deg t-stat. I'm sure you all know the car will reach it's operating temp no matter what t-stat you are using, the 180* t-stat just keeps things safer and reduces the risk of knock (more noticible with a tune). I am pretty sure the 1.4 has a beefier radiator as it is turbocharged like the older turbo Dodges did. And yes you are right about losing MPG with mods, as you add mods without a tune you are slowly (not putting your engine in danger until you do header) leaning out your engine each time. Be sure that whoever is selling you that header offers some type of compensation tune for it or you will be leaning out your engine, and yes you can lean out your engine on an n/a application. Be looking to get a wideband too, I believe I gave you information on that already and which one to get. With a tune you will get your MPG back tenfold and get driveability you never knew existed in your car. Lets hope SCT gets off their butt. @Bullfrog , we will be doing some real datalogging and tuning once SCT gets on board, call them up and tell them you are interested in Dart 2.0/2.4 support. Suspension is one of the best things to upgrade on the Dart, its handling is pretty top notch and I would run it in sanctioned events in a heartbeat.