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Discussion Starter #1
Guys, looking things over; traffic here, inquiries, inventory...I regret to say I just don't see much of a future in true Big Brake Kit sales for this platform. Win some, you lose some. It was a poke at a new platform and hasn't panned out as expected.

To that end I'm dropping the cost of the 13" DP6 kit from $1469 to $1319 and will include ground UPS on them to the US.

We currently have brackets in stock for FOUR kits total. When these are gone I do not believe we'll be machining another batch.

If you've been on the look out for, or holding onto, or thinking of...now's the time to make it happen. As a vendor I have limited time to promote these yet and of course won't renew vendor support only to dig a deeper expense hole. Please spread the word; this one's in the twilight hour.

DETAILS HERE

ORDER: via email at [email protected]
 

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First time I've ever seen you on here lol. Well hello there! And goodbye I guess...
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I appreciate that comment actually.

It supports my comments that not many readers truly browse the vendor sections. Reflect my comments that many forums (not this one) are grossly over priced. I've found forum sections for vendors not to really have much value compared to interaction on the board at other levels- working with customers on car needs, tech info etc. As some of you know I spent years on the SRT4 boards and seldom did much advertising beyond the minimum requirements from time to time. A name in a long list of companies that nobody really goes scrolling through doesn't offer that much return. Like most folks today we want our info NOW and to be FORCE FED that info. We read it quickly, chose to agree or not and move on. When was the last time you searched (really looked) for a particular item from a seller? Today we just Google what we want and shop price

It's an interesting dynamic. Like reading the ads in a paper- what's the last one you remember actually looking at completely?

Anyhow....



While I agree that 'giving back' is an important part of all forum communities there's limited resources to push new product. There's nothing wrong with the product, nor the community..they just are not in sync yet with each other. The cars usually need to be on second and third owners before the mod money is flowing. Lower payments, lower insurance, low buy cost....and the first guy paid for all the low budget mods already so what's left; the more costly items! It's normal and I have no issue with it, but there's only so much time and money to be spent per platform. It's a business at the end of the day.

The kits will be available until parts are used up. I'd consider alternate kits and making more in the future if there was a strong market. Hell, i talked to a First Gen Lightning owner yesterday who was totally bummed I pulled the plug on those after selling about 40 of them over a ten year span. Told him the same thing; get some more folks and we can revisit the package. All vehicles have a working life span for the aftermarket. Some take off with a bang (MINI, IMPALA SS...) other build up slowly (SUPER DUTY, SRT4...) some don't ever gain much traction no matter what we do (RX8, JUKE, DART maybe...) how the business rolls.
 

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After finally doing a 1/4 race and wanting to expand to doing actual track driving, I saw how much extra force I really need from the brakes. I hope when I get the money (down the line) one of the kits is still available! Sorry to see it didn't go as well on here for you. DO you have any pictures or anything of the product? Customer pictures? I have found those to "motivate" people.
 

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Hi Todd. Welcome back, or have fun going i don't know which one. either way,

I appreciate that comment actually.
It supports my comments that not many readers truly browse the vendor sections.
TRUE FACT

Vendors come and go around here on THIS forum. Its a fact of life around here. The owners are here for profit and as far as i can tell this is the most established dart forum right now. Pay your dues and stay, don't and you do not have a vendor section.AFAIK they do not discourage group buys to companies that offer dart products, AKA organizing here. This is a 2 way street though. you have been a member for little more then a year and you only have 13 posts. That is one a month average. One does not simply need to be a vendor for the pied piper to get all the mice 2 by two.

If i was a vendor here i would use some research. First, How do people READ the forums there is a post and a pole that shows how people read this forum. http://www.dodge-dart.org/forum/dodge-dart-org-polls/19885-how-do-you-view-forum.html Maybe its old school to think people would browse sections but I know personally i just browse whats been updated or commented on lately. Sometimes I go to sections and see whats out there. Take this post for example, i didn't even know your a vendor till these posts.

I've found forum sections for vendors not to really have much value compared to interaction on the board at other levels- working with customers on car needs, tech info etc. As some of you know I spent years on the SRT4 boards and seldom did much advertising beyond the minimum requirements from time to time. A name in a long list of companies that nobody really goes scrolling through doesn't offer that much return.
Keeping with just the DART forum, why is it then i know companies such as RoadRace Motorsports or Stay Fresh auto care and Redline goods? Yes they post a bit more, you get to know the person and the company, RRM stands out for LuckyJay. He participated in the forum and also advertised for his company. They also ran specials and made posts in their vendor sections that would stand out (see point 1) form time to time and yes even have sales. Im not saying that you need to have sales but just joining and thinking that people are going to come to you on the forum just because you joined isn't good enough, people have to know you exist as well.


Like most folks today we want our info NOW and to be FORCE FED that info. We read it quickly, chose to agree or not and move on. When was the last time you searched (really looked) for a particular item from a seller? Today we just Google what we want and shop price

It's an interesting dynamic. Like reading the ads in a paper- what's the last one you remember actually looking at completely?

Anyhow....
It sounds like your upset at this. Yes we all do this, who doesn't? unless your name brand specific (When i played ice hockey i ONLY used CCM stuff, no exceptions) people will shop around for price. Only if you have a solid customer base will they come and repeat sales and look for you by name.

I can think of one place you could have hit it off. SS DOT approved brake lines. Its what the people want, yes there could be debate on why on a stock car and blah blah blah. I'm sure with your sourcing and supply chain you could have come in competitive with small overhead and delivered. just my 2 cents.


It's a business at the end of the day.
Yep it all rolls down to business.

good luck.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I'm not upset at all. Please don't take it that way, we're "just talking" is all.

I grasp that putting up one or two posts is not going to have a path beaten to my door. I'm not foolish enough to believe that. On the flip side it was point out to me some time ago when we began work on this that it was a "huge market with a lot of guys who would buy this if you made it" sort of comments. Again..I know better for many the reasons I mentioned above. But I'm game; you don't know if you don't test the waters. I did/do and the water is too chilly you might say. Of course there was no promise of selling these in a heartbeat despite the props given to try it. I get that.

Yes I could partake more in other sections of the form and have/do on other boards. But there's also a limit to how many times readers want to be hit over the head with comments about how they should consider a big brake kit, links to the kit, "you should consider.." type posts and such. I'm not looking to spam folks, I don't like that stuff either. After some post and about a years input I'd say the word is out reasonably well that these are an option. Clearly we don't catch everyone all day everyday.

Part of the reason other vendors can do well and support communities better is a wider variety of product offerings. I don't sell anything but this kit. That's my choice and part of the down side to that is lower exposure. But to do well you have to supply common parts to a variety of platforms and some guys do a great job of that. No beef from me. I simply choose to do one thing and do it well; custom brake kits. I know the risks.

From the financial side if you spend $100mo to promote stuff and do that for 6mo time you're into it for $600. Now if you sell a product for $1600....you'd best sell a number of them to truly make that work. In fact without going into cost basis data you could argue the break even point for a year of advertising at that rate would take about five kit sales just to pay the advertising costs. The reality for the business is that it needs a volume of 15-20 kits a year as well as supporting product; pads, rotors, fluid etc to be really viable. When we have volume like that you see it in return also; I gave away a complete $1000 kit a couple years in a row in the MINI market in the mid decade at the largest MINI meet each year in Vegas.

I'm not opposed to doing ss flex hose kits. I do a few of them now for others. (and there are none that are DOT approved, that's marketing hype) I like the quick $100 sale as much as the other guy. Maybe we can talk about that in PM if you wish. If they are on the market from others now however then we are just fighting the price point and I'm not sure it's worth the effort/return. I'm a fair guy but won't create a price war either.

Like I said, all just conversation. I'd love to put these kits in someone's hands.
 

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I think you will see a major opportunity in the coming year when the new darts and SRT darts come out with much more power and a need to brake better sine more people will be tracking them. Those are the people you need, what we have now are people investing in a DD to make a sporty compact vs starting with a sporty compact and tracking them a lot since thats what they were designed to do.
 

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This is truly understandable to me at this time. Far too many are still under warranty, and even though I have done a few things to my car, it still doesn't warrant the need for upgraded brakes and rotors. Hopefully in the near future this will change as more cars drop off warranty, and a few of us go out on a limb and experiment. If my current project is successful, I may then need to upgrade, and hopefully, if it is successful, it will open the door for a few others as well.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I'll still be here, in business that is, when things change. I may not be a forum vendor at that time due to the above is all.

Please keep me in mind if the new hot-rod models hit the ground. There's no doubt about the ability to produce a variety of product for the car, only the difficulty and cost to promote it.

Appreciate the input. Hope I did not offend anyone..was never the intent!
 

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Well sorry to see you go however I will toss my .02 in here. Brakes unfortunately on a build are very much neglected. Most people just want to go yet they forget that they do eventually have to stop. I appreciate the fact that your selling the more neglected part of the build but again just my .02 cents try to find wiggle to possibly lower the price honestly I bet allot of owners here wouldn't mind to purchase the product if the price point was around the lower 800 mark I bet you'd sell far more. Or maybe offer some kind of promotion. Remember your selling product costing close to 1500 to a market that truly has not matured this platform is only 3 yrs old. On top of that your talking a 1500$ product to a group which essentially bought the car for either A) looks or B) economic value. Just my advice take with a grain of salt.
 

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@Todd TCE I have no doubt many would love to buy and install your BBK, for many though it seems that they want it but never get around to actually buying it lol They always seem to find some other part that is cheaper and instead of saving for this, they buy that - the next month, same thing. Good luck and I hope the Dart Market opens up, pretty sure it will when the SRT4 Dart is released.
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
It's all good...I just hoped we might find more common interest on the platform for such things. The SRT version could spark things so I certainly have my fingers crossed!

Price wise...I'll have to comment- the normal list price is a good deal. The lowered cost is foolishly low. Champagne dreams on a beer budget?

We'd all like to pay less for things in life, but find alternative kits with directional, 2pc hats/rotors, six pot calipers, brackets, pads, hoses etc..all inclusive for under $1500. SRT or not we won't see a better deal than this one. I dare say; from anyone.

To that end I do agree; the price point (high or low) doesn't fully match the car/owner demographic fully. Wish I could offer you something I'd feel good about for a lot less but I'm not sure you'd be happy or that at $700 the market would bear it then.
 

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I wish you luck, and hope the market turns around in the future, but sadly at this time I have to agree with you on the market not supporting the cost of a kit of this caliber from anyone. The sad fact is that most people with this car struggle to find the cash for am intake or a spoiler, or new wheels, let alone upgrade their drivetrain enough to require a big brake kit. IF the srt comes out, the market may turn around with second hand owners of these models along with more performance minded people getting their hands on them wanting to try to catch up to the srt. But I'm afraid that if it don't come out that there won't be a market aside from a few that go all out. This car will stay just a simple gas saver that looks fast unfortunately. Again, good luck, and thanks for the effort. It's sad to see vendors go.
 

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@Todd TCE, I have to agree with a lot of what's been stated. Once the new models come out next summer with more HP there will be a better market for a BBK. Another vendor made these up and they didn't sell very well either. At that time he asked members if they would buy his kit if they were produced. I told them it was a waste of time and money because there wouldn't be a market for a BBK on a car that makes 170 HP. As far as I know there are only a few people that actually take their Dart to a track. When the new SRT model comes out hopefully that will change or when there are Darts consistently making around 250 HP, the brakes will then definitely need to be upgraded. Good luck with your company, hopefully you stick around.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Thanks for the props guys.

As I said; I'm not down or bitching or such..we're just talking. Obviously I hoped we might have bigger market. But then I never figured I'd be buried in early 70s Carprice kit builds either! lol
 
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