[db.dartdewd]

Hello fellow fleeced Dart owners. My apologies for the length of this post, I just wanted y'all to have as much information as possible to help me figure this beast out. Also, I posted in another discussion previously regarding my Dart and its refusal to engage in reverse or drive and I haven't been able to rediscover where exactly that was. Here's the rundown:
I ran an errand a week and a half ago and when I returned to the parking lot, after having gone inside for 10, maybe 15 minutes, I started her up.
"Service Transmission" message was displayed on the instrument cluster. Shifting into drive (I have this annoying habit of backing into parking spaces-it helps when leaving bc people are idiots), another error message, "Gear not available, shift to Neutral, then R or D" or something like that, was displayed. I followed the instructions, still "Gear not available..."
Waited 8 hours for a tow truck to get her home.
The next morning, I was curious to see if I could get her to duplicate the issue. I started her up. "service transmission" message, but she shifted into gear and I was able to turn her around and pull her into the garage. No problems with either Reverse or Drive. ($#&%!!) Turned her off and checked the forum.
Found MANY MANY people have had issues with their DDCT as well. Someone had similar symptoms and I received one very off-putting solution: a bad hydraulic pump which will cost $1800 for just the part. (thank you alpinegreenneon) I remembered an old Cougar I had that leaked transmission fluid at a rate of 1qt/week (first car at 17, no mechanical experience-learned by trial and error) and had trouble shifting when the fluid got too low. Thinking along that vein, I attempted to drain and refill the DDCT since that's the ONLY way to ensure the proper amount was installed; I also figured $60 was less than $1800 and seemed to be the financially responsible route.

THE TEST DRIVE
I drove MAYBE a half mile to the local Dollar Tree. Backed into my parking spot, shut her down and went inside. After acquiring my beverage, I came out and fired her up. I was able to put her into Drive and had just pulled out of my parking spot when...."Gear not Available, blah blah blah"
($#&%!!)
Tow truck driver is called, wife comes and gets me. I wait for the call. He calls, I drive over in my truck, park next to her. Decide to see if she was ready to go... NOPE.
Here's the bugger. The driver shows up, asks for the keys. I hand em over, and make small talk about my issues with it. He shakes his head, climbs in, fires her up, BACKS OUT OF THE PARKING SPOT and pulls up to his tow truck. Hooks her with the truck and proceeds to tow her to the house.
($#&%!!) Arriving to the house, he drops the Dart, backs her up, and pulls into my driveway. Thinking he has a magic touch, I attempt to start her up and reposition her better in my driveway but she refused to engage.
After a few choice words and some phone calls to family, I grab an OBDII reader and pulled the following 4 codes off her:
P1CBE- Hydraulic pump stuck ON
P1CC0- Hydraulic pump stuck OFF
P1CBF- Hydraulic pump feedback
P2872- a manufacturer specific error/BBV Sensor circuit Low Voltage/Transmission

Basically, from what I've gathered, I have some electrical troubleshooting to do. The suggestions I discovered online were:
P1CBE - P1CC0 - P1CBF
1) a faulty Smart Driver Unit
2) a faulty Transmission Control Module
3) a harness (either the SDU or the hydraulic pump) has an open or poor electrical connection
P2872
4) consistent with MAP sensor malfunction which likely represents a separate wiring issue.

I know, long-winded, but I'm getting really frustrated. I tried to print out the wiring diagram/troubleshooter I discovered in another place in the forum, but the printout is blurry. I refuse to drag a computer or tablet under the car with me while I read it out. I'm slightly old-school.
I really don't want to buy a new hydraulic pump if I don't have to. Anybody got experience with this? or perhaps a better quality image of the wiring diagram? Thank you in advance.

**side note: All recalls have been addressed. She has 100466 miles. I've replace the oil pump and changed the oil regularly. The transmission has been replace 4 times in the 6+ years we've had her and the turbo twice. My wife is the original owner and is unsure of exactly what has been replaced by the dealership. Since we no longer have payments on her, I want to make her last as long as I can.

*****side side note: if there's anything I can do to clarify my troubles, please don't hesitate, it's kind of the reason I started THIS discussion.

Thanks -
Dave

 

[alpinegreenneon]

Intermittent problems are almost always wiring or connectors.
This schematic covers the first 3 codes.

28 - DTC-Based Diagnostics / MODULE, Transmission Control (TCM), C635 DDCT / Diagnosis and Testing

P1CBE-00-HYDRAULIC PUMP STUCK ON

Theory of Operation

This diagnostic checks the performance of the hydraulic pump. The Smart Driver Unit (SDU) which is external to the Transmission Control Module (TCM) drives the hydraulic pump based upon a PWM command signal received from the Transmission Control Module (TCM). This diagnostic uses three feedback signals. The PWM driver, internal to TCM, returns a command feedback signal. The SDU returns to the TCM the hydraulic pump driver feedback signal. The TCM separately receives the hydraulic pump feedback signal confirming the pump state.

When Monitored and Set Conditions

When Monitored: This diagnostic runs continuously when the following conditions are met:

•Ignition key is on OR the TCM is in power-on state.
•Engine is not in cranking mode.
•The Hydraulic Pressure Sensor Diagnostics have not failed.

Set Conditions:

•The TCM command to the hydraulic pump is off and the hydraulic pressure sensor output is increasing for a calibrated amount of time.


Possible Causes

PUMP COMMAND CIRCUIT SHORTED TO GROUND
SMART DRIVE UNIT (SDU)
TRANSMISSION CONTROL MODULE (TCM)




28 - DTC-Based Diagnostics / MODULE, Transmission Control (TCM), C635 DDCT / Diagnosis and Testing

P1CC0-00-HYDRAULIC PUMP STUCK OFF

Theory of Operation

This diagnostic checks the performance of the hydraulic pump. The Smart Driver Unit (SDU) which is external to the Transmission Control Module (TCM) drives the hydraulic pump based upon a PWM command signal received from the Transmission Control Module (TCM). This diagnostic uses three feedback signals. The PWM driver, internal to TCM, returns a command feedback signal. The SDU returns to the TCM the hydraulic pump driver feedback signal. The TCM separately receives the hydraulic pump feedback signal confirming the pump state. This diagnostic checks the performance of the hydraulic pump.

When Monitored and Set Conditions

When Monitored: This diagnostic runs continuously when the following conditions are met:

•Ignition is on OR the TCM is in power-on
•The engine is not in cranking mode.
•The Hydraulic Pressure Sensor Diagnostics have not failed.
•The Hydraulic Pump Driver feedback diagnostic has not failed.

Set Conditions:

•The TCM command to the hydraulic pump is on and the hydraulic pressure sensor output is not increasing for a calibrated amount of time.


Possible Causes

HYDRAULIC PUMP
HYDRAULIC SYSTEM LEAK
OPEN OR HIGH RESISTANCE
SMART DRIVE UNIT (SDU)
TRANSMISSION CONTROL MODULE (TCM)



28 - DTC-Based Diagnostics / MODULE, Transmission Control (TCM), C635 DDCT / Diagnosis and Testing

P1CBF-00-HYDRAULIC PUMP FEEDBACK

Theory of Operation

This diagnostic checks the performance of the hydraulic pump. The Smart Driver Unit (SDU) which is external to the Transmission Control Module (TCM) drives the hydraulic pump based upon a PWM command signal received from the Transmission Control Module (TCM). This diagnostic uses three feedback signals. The PWM driver, internal to TCM, returns a command feedback signal. The SDU returns to the TCM the hydraulic pump driver feedback signal. The TCM separately receives the hydraulic pump feedback signal confirming the pump state. This diagnostic checks the performance of the hydraulic pump.

When Monitored and Set Conditions

When Monitored: This diagnostic runs continuously when the following conditions are met:

•Enable Conditions for Check 1:

◦Ignition is on OR the TCM is in power-on state.
◦The engine is not in cranking mode.
◦The Hydraulic Pressure Sensor Diagnostics have not failed.

•Enable Conditions for Check 2:

◦Ignition is on OR the TCM is in power-on state.
◦The engine is not in cranking mode.
◦The Hydraulic Pressure Sensor Diagnostics have not failed.
◦The hydraulic pump driver feedback diagnostic has not failed.

Set Conditions:

•Malfunction Criteria for Check 1:

◦At least one of the following conditions is true for a calibrated amount of time:
◾The TCM command to the hydraulic pump is off and the hydraulic pressure sensor output is not increasing AND the SDU feedback status indicates that the pump is on.
◾The TCM command to the hydraulic pump is on and the hydraulic pressure sensor output is increasing AND the SDU feedback status indicates that the pump is off.


•Malfunction Criteria for Check 2:

◦The failure is detected if at least one of the following conditions is true for a calibrated amount of time:
• The TCM command to the hydraulic pump is off and the hydraulic pressure sensor output is not increasing AND the TCM command feedback status indicates that the pump is on.
•The TCM command to the hydraulic pump is on and the hydraulic pressure sensor output is increasing AND the TCM command feedback status indicates that the pump is off.


Possible Causes

PUMP FEEDBACK SIGNAL CIRCUIT OPEN
PUMP FEEDBACK SIGNAL CIRCUIT SHORTED TO GROUND
PUMP FEEDBACK SIGNAL CIRCUIT SHORTED TO VOLTAGE
SMART DRIVE UNIT (SDU)
TRANSMISSION CONTROL MODULE (TCM)



28 - DTC-Based Diagnostics / MODULE, Transmission Control (TCM), C635 DDCT / Diagnosis and Testing

P2872-00-CLUTCH 1 STUCK ENGAGED

Theory of Operation

The odd clutch normally functions at positions in between fully engaged (clutch closed) and fully disengaged (clutch open). This diagnostic checks if the odd clutch is stuck in a position closer to the clutch closed position than the requested position. This is caused either by a mechanical failure of the clutch or by a blocked odd clutch solenoid valve which keeps fluid pressure too low and the clutch closed. The odd clutch solenoid valve has a characteristic shown in the picture below. When the solenoid valve current is high, the valve opens and the fluid pressure disengages the odd clutch.

When Monitored and Set Conditions

When Monitored: This diagnostic runs continuously when the following conditions are met:

•Ignition is on or the Transmission Control Module (TCM) is in power-on state.
•Engine is not in cranking mode.
•Power supply is between 7 - 24 volts.
•Main Micro Processor (MMP) supply has not failed.
•The pump has been activated at least once during the drive cycle.
•The odd clutch electrovalve diagnostic has not failed.
•The odd clutch position sensor diagnostic has not failed.
•The Serial Peripheral Interface (SPI) communication hardware diagnostic has not failed.
•The hydraulic pressure is greater than a calibrated value.

Set Conditions:

•The output value of the odd clutch position sensor is greater than the sum of the odd clutch position command and a calibrated value AND the odd clutch current command is greater than the sum of the zero flow current value and a calibrated value for a calibrated amount of time.


Possible Causes

TRANSMISSION HYDRAULIC SYSTEM
TRANSMISSION MECHANICAL OPERATION
TRANSMISSION CONTROL MODULE (TCM)


The pump motor is available as a separate part. A motor can have a dead spot.

DDCTparts2.pdf

drive.google.com

 

[db.dartdewd]

thank you!! that should keep me busy for a few days. updates to follow...

db

 

[db.dartdewd]

i got her up on the jackstands yesterday. the dealership has been the ONLY mechanics who've serviced the transmission and turbo (both have been serviced multiple times) and I found something disturbing. while I no longer have the skid plate (thank you ride height), the harness is in- what I would call- rough shape. there's a freaking twist-tie keeping the harnesses from contacting hot components.

I am going to the dealership to see if I can get the service records on her.

In the Navy, I was an aircraft electrician and performed cable and connector repair. I can fix this, I think.

thanks again, alpinegreenneon, for the wiring diagram.

 

[alpinegreenneon]

Here are some more schematics that might be helpful and easier to print than the one that shows everything on the DDCT.

 

[db.dartdewd]

The following images are examples of the dealership's approved quality in repairs. They performed all the transmission work. I am going to the dealership AGAIN to address my concerns. I hope I don't end up on the 10 o'clock news tonight.

 

[alpinegreenneon]

The one with the worm clamp is beyond belief. That needs to be replaced. It's amazing your DDCT worked.

 

[db.dartdewd]

I've talked to the dealership AND Chrysler. I have a case #. the dealership has agreed to test the transmission harness on Monday. at that time, I am going to show them the photos I took. I will be following up on my case that afternoon to see whom I send copies to for documentation.

We'll see how much they stand behind their cars.

 

[alpinegreenneon]

If they deny any responsibility for repairing it, replacing a harness is not that difficult. Just find a self serve junkyard with a wrecked Dart with a DDCT. Most yards now have an online inventory with the VIN. Use the VIN to get a buildsheet before going to the yard.
Plug the VIN into this link:

FCA RAM

fcacommunity.force.com

I have spent most of my adult life learning how to repair my own vehicles. It just took one bad dealer experience and I'll never take my vehicle to a dealer again for any repair, even a recall.

 

[db.dartdewd]

I've searched the local salvage yards; the ONE Dart I found was missing the engine and transmission. I'm hoping the threat of a lawsuit will keep them in check. I won't trust the dealership with the repairs unless they take ownership of the poor quality they've exhibited thus far.

 

[alpinegreenneon]

Part number for the trans harness:
68211410AA
Part number for the valve body harness:
68211415AA

 

[db.dartdewd]

sitting here in the dealership while they ring out the transmission harness.
"it's been two years, sir. a lot of people have come and gone since then..."
not a good start for them. update to follow.

update. two years since they put in the transmission. not since they've worked on the car. I have a work order that states they repaired the ground. the transmission they installed just finished its 60,000 miles and died. the harness is "good". I can't believe anything that they say because of the repairs they've made and how humans tend to cover their hides when confronted with evidence of the subpar quality they've allowed.

onward and upward with the rest of the system.

 

[jsblanch]

sitting here in the dealership while they ring out the transmission harness.
"it's been two years, sir. a lot of people have come and gone since then..."
not a good start for them. update to follow.

It's been two years since they last worked on the car? I'd be surprised if the dealership would admit to that being their work after that much time has elapsed, or that they would even be able to know either way. In their place, I'd probably suggest that somebody who was unqualified and didn't know what they were doing had worked on the car in the intervening period and take absolutely no ownership of the damage and problems it has currently. It may not be true, but it is definitely plausible from their perspective, and FCA probably can't help you here (and even if they could, they almost certainly won't help you). They will just close your case based on the dealership's findings, which they have no actual authority to comment on.

Still, I will hope that the dealership does recognize their garbage work and makes it right. Your car seems to have always been a bit of a nightmare, and I don't like to see insult added to injury.

 

[jakeumm]

I know its been a while, but any updates on what the fix was? I just had mine throw the service transmission and throw a P1CC0 code today, that was the only code it was throwing

 

[gsbhakna]

Hi @db.dartdewd,
I too faced the same intermittent transmission issue this weekend and with the help of OBD, I got the same codes:
P1CBF-00
P1CC0-00
P1CBE-00

On searching about these, I landed on this forum.
Could you please let me know, how did you get to fix the issue?

Thanks a lot